Discussion: AP Poll: Most Think Trump Has Illegally Or Unethically Colluded With Russia

[rickjones]

Both Nanez and Stephenson, like 63 percent of Americans, say Trump has tried to impede or obstruct the investigations into whether his campaign had Russian ties.

And while impeding the investigations into his and his campaign’s ties to Russia, he’s also impeding the basic investigation into how Russia interfered with and influenced the election, and what steps must be taken to ensure it doesn’t happen again…and again…and again, regardless of whether there was actual “collusion” (which there was). The fact of Russian interference is not a “Democrat hoax.”

[sniffit]

Call it misplaced concern then…I admit “fear” is loaded. We need to be taking advantage of how gullible and stupid the Amurikkkan people can be, not patting ourselves on the back for our moral restraint.

As for crying wolf, I don’t think you end up looking like the boy who cried wolf when you effectively message that the investigation is legitimate while refraining from or explicitly stating that you’re not demanding a certain conclusion or conviction before process.

[pluckyinky]

They’re NEVER leaving him, which is part of what I’m not understanding about your argument I think. They’re a lost cause.

That’s not what I meant. I know they’re a lost cause. I’ve been saying that for months. My point though is that as long as they’re with him, Republicans aren’t going to do anything to stop any of this either because they need those voters too. That’s why there’s nothing we can do to stop him until next year when we boot out his enablers.

[danf]

I think where the Dems are failing is in not setting the impeachment bar. They need to be out there everyday saying, “Obstruction of Justice is an impeachable offense. It simply is. We need to protect the crown jewels of our democracy, and perhaps the most coveted of all those jewels is the belief that no one is above the law. If there was collusion with the Russians, we’re looking at treason. And I don’t use that word lightly. It’s treasonous to collude with a foreign government to disrupt our cherished democracy. All the worst with a dictator like Putin. And if collusion is shown within reasonable doubt, and the Republication leaders fail to act, they are complicit in this treason.”

[khyber900]

We’ve gone past the inflection point. The news for Trump won’t get better. We learn more each week and the public is on the right path in terms of assessing Trump with even nearly a quarter of GOPers indicating that Trump did something illegal or unethical. The point here is that this poll is about Trump’s conduct, not someone else’s. What this means is that the people are ahead of our media. They’re not playing this game that somehow there are 25 lone wolf actors out there not taking direction from anyone. They know if stuff happened, Trump is responsible.

[pshah]

I was especially suspicious when she knew what motion in limine meant.

[edys]

I am actually flabbergasted by the percentage of Republicans who still support Trump. Dumb struck I think is the appropriate term.

[maximus]

Isn’t everything about Donnie terrifying?

This story on Trump's Russia paranoia is terrifying

[khyber900]

The thing for Dems to do is to continue to get on record demanding resignation and expand the scope to sexual harassment + #trumprussia. Sexual harassment is the easier political play because the GOP has literally no defense, and after AL-Sen many hardline Trump defenders are backing off because a political price was paid for nominating Moore. But what earns respect, votes and legitimacy is when one party is willing to stand up for the Republic. That’s why tackling the issue of resignation, accountability and impeachment for #trumprussia is important to highlight during the campaign.

We got the opportunity to change America in 2008 when we came out against the Iraq war in 2005-06 and committed to withdrawing from Iraq. We had no power to do it at the time, and Bush stymied us from 2006-08 but we did force him to sign a timetable for withdrawal with the Iraqi government and we paved the way for Barack Obama. We used that big majority to remake the US foreign policy, economic policy and health care policy. We did right by the people and by the Republic.

We need to take a similar approach now. We’re off to a good start on the sexual harassment front, but more Dems need to follow Adam Schiff and Eric Swalwell.

[rickjones]

[quote=“pshah, post:66, topic:66402, full:true”]
I was especially suspicious when she knew what motion in limine meant.
[/quote]Well, she won’t be getting a nomination to the U.S. District Court. Way overqualified. I bet she’s even been in a real courthouse somewhere, too.

[pluckyinky]

It tells me that with just a little competence, we could be castrating these fucks like it’s a Gelding Day party at the OK Corral.

Here’s the thing, I think that’s exactly what will happen next year. I think we’ll win seats that make us go, “Holy shit, did we really just win (insert name of batshit state or district)?” I think Paul Ryan is talking retirement because he knows it too. I wouldn’t be surprised if Mitch McConnell starts making calls to Gov. Bevin so they can discuss who he’ll name as his successor when he steps down.

[alyoshakaramazov1]

Actually, if only 60% of REPUBLICANS think Trump did nothing wrong, that’s astounding. I don’t think I’ve ever seen Repubs in ANY poll drop to 60%.

Trumpy’s in trouble. One way or another.

[darrtown]

I do not understand CNN’s fascination with Rick Santorum as a pundit.

[mattinpa]

Even more important, how many people are calling themselves Republicans and how many Democrats these days?

This is a hugely important and often-ignored point. For months the numbers of people identifying as Republican has shrunk, which misleadingly maintains the percentage of support for Trump among the remaining ones. That’s not all—just yesterday there was a poll showing his support diminishing among FOX viewers. It goes beyond Russia. He simply hasn’t been able to portray himself as effective, despite and to some extent even because of his crude, obvious attempts to simply assert that he is. In the end he never “pivoted” and never “acted Presidential,” and he never made much of an effort to do what successful Presidents do. None of that capacity was in him. And so it goes, ever downward.

[pluckyinky]

To say collusion is not illegal, as Republicans love pointing out, is to miss the point entirely.

It’s a word game they’re playing in order to say that even if he’s guilty, he didn’t commit a crime, so there’s really no need for an investigation.

[thunderingtomtwo]

Collusion is an element of a conspiracy. The NFL is being sued for colluding against a QB who started the kneeling during the National anathema to protest against the lack of justice for black lives.

[mattinpa]

I do not understand CNN’s fascination with Rick Santorum as a pundit.

I think it’s his strong willingness to play the part married to his tendency to say crazy stuff (aka “good copy.”)

[littlegirlblue]

Perhaps the misguided lady was thinking of the old Harry Nilsson song Put The Lime In The Coconut

[fiftygigs]

Trump’s problem is that he lies. His plain spoken promises during the election helped excite the Tea Party insurrectionists. Now, Trump has to resort to rationalizing higher health care costs as a good thing, and a tax increase will really put more money in our pockets.

He lies, and even the dumbest can hear it.

[pluckyinky]

Which in turn means that the number of “truly independent indys” who are siding with Trump and the GOP is even lower than it already looks in these poll results.

That’s a really great point. If a smaller and shrinking share of the electorate is Republican then that 32-35% polling may actually be the upper 20s because polling is being weighted too heavily with Republicans.